Bring on the Magic Wand!

In other blogs this week with the help of JD's handy calculator we determined that the ordinary taxpayer is on the hook for an additional $5600+- to help bail out the special interests and lobbyists responsible for our current economic  crisis which by all financial measures exceeds the great depression of 1929.

Now our County Commissioners show that they are dancing with special interests in approving the new development across from the fair grounds.  In every dance someone has to lead, it is not the commissioners who are leading, it is pay back for what contributions have been made to their campaigns that allows the special interests to pull the strings of our beloved elected officials. To say otherwise is dancing the Jive.

Having planned and studied economic growth, having started companies and employing hundreds I marvel at the expressions that the Toll way will create jobs.  It certainly will at each access point you can expect Convenience stores, McDonalds, Burger King and a few hotel jobs possibly in the future.  Great return on our investment right?  Yes when it is time to build some of our builders have a shot at making money and hiring a few skilled Mexicans so their product is price competitive.  Oh I forgot to mention those who will be receiving payments for the travel on the Tollway and those who will make the stickers for your car so you can be billed each month.

Who benefits from this Beltway some special interests and developers who wag the tails of the commissioners.  Does the taxpayer benefit, only if you are a believer that increased taxes are a source of pride in our community.  Where are the high paying jobs going to come, and what will they support.

WAKE UP CLAY COUNTY, how much do you want to give away of the few hard earned dollars you make.  You have elected a board of commissioners that are puppets and have no problem allowing you to foot the bill for the benefit of their financial supporters.  Unfortunately none of them have ever been industry leaders, running a law practice is not an industry, nor having service offices for insurance or mortgages or real estate sales.

Industry is manufacturing, skilled jobs, production lines etc.  This tollway will not generate any of those.  Hanging your hat on food service jobs  is nothing you should be proud to generate in your district.

Mike, I am more convinced than ever that this toll road should be stopped. Is there any chance that the CTLAC or CAN would be able to aid in this initiative? I understand CAN will have its monthly get together next Thursday and Ms. Padgett will be there.

Lily's Lore "I don't ever want to be rescued And I don't ever want to be saved I got a feelin' that I'm gonna be alive forever Dancin' on the edge of a grave..." Jim Steinman

Use you calculator and find out how much each taxpayer is on the hook for the outer beltway and get back with me.

Would you prefer that all of these categories suchas builders, businesses, special interest groups not make any money from the outer beltway? Would that make it alright with you for the beltway to be put in place? Or was your whole thread a message that you'd rather not see the beltway come through? 

You stated that you've employed hundreds.  Hypothetically speaking when they come to work and i'm sure they'd rather get there faster even though they probably don't want to be there.   Don't you think they're gonna want some starbucks or McDonalds on the way.  It only makes good commom sense that these businesses you've mentioned be placed where there is an influx of customers, true.  Those buildings have to be built usually by builders, true.  And to make it easier going through the toll road, those sticker comapanies allowing frequent drivers to pass directly through verses stopping to pay the toll, those companies require income to survive, true.  But the beltway passing through period, with special interest groups up the butt of government officials forcing this plan onto taxpayers, not true yet, entirely. 

It will cost the taxpayer money to build and use the beltway, it is a money generating tool for the government and special interest.  It is the destruction of the former old clay county being transformed into the new clay county.  On the other hand, eventhough taxpayers will finance the beltway and pay for usage everyday, they will benefit by getting to work faster, maybe safer.  Eventually the first month newness will simmer and everyone not financially inclined will switch back to the same old blanding or branan field or 17.  Those who are financially inclined will continue to use the beltway probably still a hefty sum of drivers.  Several pros and several cons. 

I agree with most of what you stated Fred.  I don't care for your condescending attitude towards those who might desire or need a food service job or another little job apparently not important enough in your mind to be an accomplishment.  The toll way will promote economic growth and produce jobs, it will allieviate some of the traffic on the three major duval access highways and yeah it'll further cripple our government officials being tied down by special interests all while screwing some taxpayers who do not desire to see the beltway pushed through.

Having no exp. or planning with the examination of economic growth, it will promote such.  And with exp.  in this field, you also know that economic growth usually costs the taxpayers, rather they choose to do so or special interets and the government chooses to do so. 

In June i wanted a truck for my personal benefit, so i went and got a loan and purchased a truck, i think i own the seats now.  Gettiing the truck would not have been possible had i not paid for it or wanted it.  The same applies here but afftect more than just my personal benefit.  I want an outer beltway for an easier ride to work and easier ride home or at least an easier ride on the three major highways we currently have due to less traffic on those roads.  I am willing to pay for such, i do think it will promote economic growth in the county.  I am not willing to pay for any special add ons or tie in's that special interests or the government wants to magically push through, i just want the road and a McDonalds at the start so i can get my morning breakfast.  I'm sure there are thousands of other who support the beltway, but they as well have to be willing to pay for it.  With continued growth in this county and three highways with limited space to enlarge clay county must wake up as you said and support the beltway.  There are of course other options as always, i just think this is the best one available.   

I'm sorry, is it a one way street?

Think Future.  When............................I say when, the housing economy picks back up and there are home spread all the way to keystone, years from now.  When, the plans are initiated for the new interchange at I 10, I 295 and I 95.  Think of how many individuals will change their driving patterns for getting to work.  True, people who drive on 17 and people who work on the south part of the southside will still have to use blanding and 17.  But the population of drivers using that stretch of road should, i say should be lowered.  Twenty years from now do we want to be another seminole county in the mornings?  Or do we at least want to have the option of being a leader in future urban planning?  and no i don't support the toll itself.

Foxx;

A question for you. Did you go to the web site and do any research before you went on your rant?

If so would you please provide me with the link that shows how this tollway is going to do anything to solve the Blanding/17 traffic problem? I must have missed that section while I was doing my research.

Can you tell me where the on/off ramps are going to be located? I can answer that one for you. No you can't because they are being negotiated on the fly. You think there might be one someplace near this new PUD?

I'd love to see a beltway in Clay County. The problem is that 'Locally Preferred' took that option away from us when whoever 'Locally Preferred' is decided that the Pink route was the one they wanted. Out of 5 possible routes that was the only one that the state would not build as a beltway.

As a matter of fact even the toll road authorities wouldn't touch the Pink route because it cannot meet state regulations as to supporting itself. If those numbers won't support the road they sure as heck can't support the road and make a profit too. You don't need a calculator to figure that out.

Can you provide me with the link that discloses how much toll this road is going to cost users? The only one I've been able to find is the one that gives the numbers the state used to decide they couldn't touch this thing.

Can you provide me with some information on how much the bridge toll is going to be? The only number I could find was that it would 'start' at $2 and that is in addition to the toll to get to the bridge. But again that was the number the state used to wash their hands of the deal.

If it cost the tax payer money it is not economic growth. Economic growth is supposed to broaden the tax base and help to cut taxes while providing jobs. And they want us to give up the property tax on this land. How is that economic growth? 

Foxx, if they build this road it will surly make travel where it leads to faster while you are on the tollway. The problem is that once you get off that tollway you are right back on the same old overcrowded worn out roads we have right now.

There aren't any grand and glorious plans to improve them. There is no solution for Blanding/17 in this plan. There is no money in this deal for that. If you put a fresh coat of paint on rotten wood all you have is rotten wood that looks pretty on the outside for a short amount of time.

There is no guarantee that we will get one business that provides high paying jobs. People are not going to quit their jobs in Duval County and start working here in Clay County no matter how many new jobs you create here. They are going to stay with the companies they have worked with for years.  

Political advertisement paid for and approved by, Mike Heemer, write-in, for Commission Chair.

I heard the same job outlook for Fleming Island. What did we get more service and retail jobs. Please this tollway is a disaster waiting to be bailout with taxpayers money.

The beltway is for special interest. The college drive north extension is for the fine citizens in clay county.

Now hang on a second.  I am open to other possible routes especially if they make better sense and can be approved by the state.  I don't support the giving up of the property taxes and i won't mess with your social security although, you have been paying for it your entire life.  I don't know how many jobs this endeavor will provide, how big or small.  I do think we will always be a feeder county with population on the increase and the more jobs we can provide here rather part time or full time the better.   Clay county will never be the big star of northeast florida, but we can imporve ourselves.     

Lily,

I'm not a member of either of these PACs so I certainly can't speak for them. But I think there are only two ways that this project in its current form could be changed or challenged.

One would be for the County Commissioners to rescind their support of this project as it now stands and to mandate a state built beltway or a state controlled toll road project.

The only other way I could see this happening is if a PAC was formed to start a grass roots movement to stop this tollway in its current form. My thinking is it would have to be a PAC that had only that one goal in mind and with the idea that once the battle was won or lost the PAC would disband.

Political advertisement paid for and approved by, Mike Heemer, write-in, for Commission Chair.

Foxx;

That is my point exactly. There were 4 other routes that the state would have built as a beltway using normal funding. Somewhere along the way 'Locally Preferred' convinced the state that the best route for this road was a new 5th route (Pink) that they were not even looking at due to cost.

You really do need to go poking around that web site. There is a ton of information there. One document I was really impressed with was the list of companies that were involved with this project that were listed as having a 'conflict of interest'. I forget what the percentage was but it was certainly a significant number.

There are also some real gems in some of the minutes of the public hearings that were held. Take a hard look at when and where they were held and who was in attendance.

See if you can find any reference as to how much profit they will be able to make.

As much information that is there, what is significant is the information that is not there. And what is not there is some mighty important information that I would have asked for before I stuck my signature on an endorsement for this project.

What the Commissioners signed was a blank check. And if you don't support giving up the property taxes you need to do some research to see who is quoted as saying they don't think this company should have to pay them.

Political advertisement paid for and approved by, Mike Heemer, write-in, for Commission Chair.

I think my inital response may have been misconstrued in that i only support this current plan, not so.  I'll continue with the web site, i've been there several times, i didn't enter into the conversation as naive as i used to. 

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/topstories/news-article.aspx?storyid=108278

Other Proposed Routes:

http://www.sjrbridge.com/project_overview.htm

What do you mean by normal funding.......oh wait.....................online users.....mike did you go to bed already

 Fred-- I don't have a problem at all with hiring a few "skilled Mexicans" to work in our businesses or community.  I do have a problem with anyone who hires "illegal immigrants" no matter what their ethnic background.  Be careful not to stereotype or "tag" those who are here legally just because they may be Latino.  Spell it out correctly who you're talking about.  Don't let your words come back to haunt you, especially if you want to jump into the political arena.  Our Hispanic residents make up a great enough number to be counted as a swing vote when it's really needed.  Outside of that, they came here legally to find a better way of life.

Foxx;

I define normal funding to be money coming through FDOT. The money that we pay in taxes etc for building and maintaining roads.

Things like a portion of the federal gas tax, a portion of the state gas tax etc. This is why we pay those taxes. It is to build roads. FDOT was going to use that type of money to build a beltway until 'Locally Preferred' decided on the Pink route. 

I asked one of the candidates during the Primary campaign about why we were not going to let the state build the road with tax money on one of the other 4 routes. The answer I got shocked me. 'Why should the people from down south pay taxes to build a road here?'

The reason is because we all pay into the same fund and the roads get built in the state. Our share goes to roads in the south and the west of the state just like theirs would have went to build a road here. That reasoning seemed to be beyond their comprehension.

FDOT is going to spend that money someplace, it just isn't going to be here. Some other portion of Florida just got a heck of a gift. Mighty nice of us don't you think? They get a 'free' road while we get to have a tollway.

This is a prime example of why we need to make Lobbyists register. Not just here but everywhere. How many undocumented conversations do you think might have taken place to sell this abomination?

Foxx, I'm sorry but I just don't think you are digging deep enough. I love the line from Jerry Maguire: "Show me the money".   

Political advertisement paid for and approved by, Mike Heemer, write-in, for Commission Chair.

The politicians running Clay County and those pretenders soon to be elected have falsely promised industrial type jobs as a fall out to the Beltway, Mr. Foxx.  I was merely pointing out they are misleading you and the rest of the people of Clay county and that the actual jobs will be the lower paying jobs at places like McDonalds.  If you believe that the level of jobs you want created by the beltway are those then by all means support it.

One of my first blogs I noted the different locations that were planned for the beltway, and I noted that if the type of jobs you want are high paying industrial manufacturing jobs you are making the wrong selection.  The choice should favor the Keystone Heights area where there is ample reasonably priced land that can support those jobs.

I also in a previous Blog noted other alternatives that would handle all the projected traffic needs for the county and in fact the county has those studies in hand.  Unfortunately those studies do not favor certain interests in the county and as a result more costly solutions to the taxpayer are being favored by those who have accepted gratuities in the form of donations for their candidacy.  Others in those positions have conflicts of interest up the ying yang.

I favor a route that would enhance the Keystone Heights area, too much attention in the county favors the hwy 17 crowd and the Green Cove areas.

The other alternatives planned for the county would permit the same development, offer excellent ingress and egress and not beat up on the taxpayer.

I do not begrudge anyone special interests,builders etc from making money.  What offends me is the fact that they have to buy their way for getting approval with the vast amounts of money going toward the election process.  This buying your profits give an unfair advantage to those who simply play by the doctrine of fairness and competition which our democracy was founded.

As far as being politically motivated, and watching what I say for political purposes, too many politicians do that.  As far as I am concerned somethings tip toed around for political purposes weaken the fabric and integrity of our govenment.  When I say skilled Mexicans I note that they have gotten their skills and work hard for less than many of our skilled labor.  I note that during the boom the builders used the people that would work for less in order to enhance their product.  That was good business on their part, I also noted that there was a difference in the quality of work between the skill sets ethnic backgrounds during that boom.  The skilled Mexicans did a better job for less than those of other backgrounds.  My point earlier was the builders will resort to the best labor available at the cheapest price and that most in Clay county will not be hired, but transits will.

Anyway my skin has thickened since I started to blog in June so it does not matter.  My point is WAKE UP, look what has happened to your economy by the leaders.  Look what has happened when you allow special interests to buy leadership so that they can profit.  You support special interests controlling that is your choice.  But do not cry when you have no money left to pay your bills since it is all in their pockets.

The beltway is just one of the many ways the taxpayer is screwed.  If you like it that is your choice, it is not mine, I feel I pay too much in taxes already bailing out the mistakes of bought and paid for politicians.  Foxx ask your self the next time you file your taxes just how much extra your paying to bail out  those special interests.  Would it not be better to have a government that is fair and equitable.

The point I am trying to make is not to deprive any developer or builder a profit.  It is that those who oversee the spending of our taxes should use the best method of solving the problems and make sure it is efficient, cost effective and will not further create problems in the future.  This should be done for the peoples interest primarily and first since those in government are there at the will of the people. 

The second point I am trying to make it that there are better alternatives to what is happening.  Honest politicians would know that and support those.  Honest politicians would also know what type of jobs follow certain types of improvements.  Honest politicians would not promise jobs that they have no clue as to how to acquire.